Can't hit high notes

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bebopluvr
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Can't hit high notes

Postby bebopluvr » May 05, 2019 1:36 pm

Hi,

Trying desperately to match pitch by singing. I'm a baritone. EarMaster keeps trying to make me a tenor. Ain't gonna happen. It's hard to match by singing an octave lower. Is there a way to set the range of tones used in pitch matching so I don't have to hit notes way above middle C?

TIA

Bill

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bebopluvr
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Re: Can't hit high notes

Postby bebopluvr » May 05, 2019 1:43 pm

Nevermind. Just found the vocal range setting. As a technical writer, gotta say EM documentation needs A LOT of work.

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Quentin
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Re: Can't hit high notes

Postby Quentin » May 07, 2019 4:41 am

Hi,

In the Beginner's course, you'll only get questions in the G-clef regardless of your tone range, as explained in the lesson introduction. You can sing in the octave of your choice and EarMaster will transpose everything silently.
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bebopluvr
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Re: Can't hit high notes

Postby bebopluvr » May 07, 2019 7:34 am

Thanks -- somehow missed that in the intro. I still say the documentation is useless.

Plus, asking a beginning singer to match pitch an octave or more below what's played...not exactly a beginner's skill.

Beginning to think Ear Master isn't what it's supposed to be.

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Re: Can't hit high notes

Postby Quentin » May 08, 2019 12:52 am

It is common practice to introduce the treble clef before moving on to other clefs in courses for beginners. Since not all users have a voice range within the treble clef, EarMaster lets the users sing the pitches in any octave they find comfortable and transposes weverything automatically. If you have a suggestion for a better solution that doesn't involve using other clefs, we would be happy to consider changing this :) . We have just been at a music show where very young kids were doing that very exercise without problems, so I am not sure how problematic it is, besides the fact that it should probably be explained better.

I reckon that the documentation could be denser. We do have plans to work on that aspect.
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bebopluvr
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Re: Can't hit high notes

Postby bebopluvr » May 08, 2019 7:32 am

It's a problem for me. I guess Denmark children are way more talented than I am.

What's wrong with showing the Bass Clef? You seem so convinced you have it right that you can skip the answer.

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Quentin
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Re: Can't hit high notes

Postby Quentin » May 09, 2019 1:47 am

Initially, the Beginner's Course used the vocal range selected by the user. Then we had a lot of complaints that the F-clef and the C-clef were not suitable for beginners. Therefore we changed it to always use the G-clef, allowing users to sing their answers in any octave.

It's not easy to make everyone happy. There are many possible approaches and preferences, and our job is to find the best solution for most users. We are never blindly convinced that our solutions are the best, this is just not how we work. We are perfectionists, always on the lookout for better ways to do things. So if you have a suggestion to make the exercise work better for beginners, we would be very happy to know it.

Notice that in any other area of EarMaster, the software WILL use your vocal range setting and diplay notes using either the treble, bass, tenor or Alto clef.
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Re: Can't hit high notes

Postby Quentin » May 10, 2019 2:51 am

Your post made us think a lot about this aspect of the beginner's course, so we have started a public poll/discussion on our Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/earmaster
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Tim
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Re: Can't hit high notes

Postby Tim » Jan 10, 2020 4:48 pm

I have exactly the same problem as bebopluver - I'm a beginner, baritone with a limited range. The C above middle C is a stretch, and the D above that is out of range. Being a beginner, and a not very talented one at that, I also have trouble hitting these notes in falsetto, and I can't reliably sing a note an octave higher or lower than the example. (I'm just going through the helpful suggestions of more experienced users one by one).

To me, the clef (bass or treble) isn't the issue, it's the notes I'm being asked to sing. In the beginner singing exercises the only notes it is asking me to sing are C and D. If I could ask it to drop the pitch a couple of notes (down to A from C, for example), I'd be fine. (Am I missing something? Maybe I've missed this feature). I know your software can handle ledger lines, because middle C is already on one - how about adding a second ledger line to the treble clef and using it?

Great software by the way!

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Re: Can't hit high notes

Postby bebopluvr » Apr 12, 2020 4:17 pm

Tim wrote:
> I have exactly the same problem as bebopluver - I'm a beginner, baritone
> with a limited range. The C above middle C is a stretch, and the D above
> that is out of range. Being a beginner, and a not very talented one at
> that, I also have trouble hitting these notes in falsetto, and I can't
> reliably sing a note an octave higher or lower than the example. (I'm just
> going through the helpful suggestions of more experienced users one by
> one).
>
> To me, the clef (bass or treble) isn't the issue, it's the notes I'm being
> asked to sing. In the beginner singing exercises the only notes it is
> asking me to sing are C and D. If I could ask it to drop the pitch a couple
> of notes (down to A from C, for example), I'd be fine. (Am I missing
> something? Maybe I've missed this feature). I know your software can handle
> ledger lines, because middle C is already on one - how about adding a
> second ledger line to the treble clef and using it?
>
> Great software by the way!


Agree with Tim except for the last point. I can't sing the notes Quentin seems to think anyone can do. So, not great software. Frankly, I'd like my money back. I have to skip the pitch matching which is the most important skill to master.
I went ahead and hired a tutor with a piano so I can match pitches. Earmaster is next to useless for me.

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Quentin
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Re: Can't hit high notes

Postby Quentin » Apr 14, 2020 1:46 am

Pitch matching of the Beginner's Course is a tiny part of the software. It's a handful of lessons out of 2500... And you can still practice it in any tone range with the Melody Singback exercise. Not saying that the pitch matching lesson of the Beginner's Course shouldn't work the best way possible, of course, and that's what we try to achieve with the poll we published. Before we change such a central part of the exercise, we need to be sure it's a request shared by many users.

The fact that you can sing your answer in any octave you want is, to me, a great feature. The problem here is that we have, for pedagogical purposes, fixed the tone range to the soprano range in the Beginner's Course (and not other areas of the software!), and it seems that transposing to other octaves is more problematic than we thought.

I am just wondering, what do you do if you need to sing back a tune whistled by someone or played on a soprano flute? Surely you are not singing the notes at the same octave as the whistling or the flute, you transpose the melody to a comfortable tone range. Or am I missing something?
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TheSatanist666
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Re: Can't hit high notes

Postby TheSatanist666 » Dec 02, 2020 1:31 pm

Pitch matching of the Beginner's Course is a tiny part of the software
But it's probably the most important part for beginners.
what do you do if you need to sing back a tune whistled by someone or played on a soprano flute?
What are the chances that something like that happens to a beginner?

Code: Select all

It is common practice to introduce the treble clef before moving on to other clefs in courses for beginners.
I don't know much about clefs (only that the treble one is above the middle C and the bass one is below the middle C) and to be honest I don't really care. I'm just a guitarist who wants to improve his ear training abilities (see, I don't even know the proper name of it) and be able to understand music better and maybe, just maybe, be able to learn songs by ear and have better time composing his awesome metal riffs.
very young kids were doing that very exercise without problems
Oh, I don't doubt that kids are able to produce much higher sounds than adult males with vocal range from E2 to A4.

asking a beginning singer to match pitch an octave or more below what's played
THANK YOU!!! +1

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Quentin
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Re: Can't hit high notes

Postby Quentin » Dec 03, 2020 4:30 am

I have answered you in the other thread here: https://www.earmaster.com/community/forum/3/5609.html
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